GMBob wrote: It's a slow process, but eventually we will reach a point where everything's balaanced and all skills are equal.

And the game becomes boring.
If I have a dollar and you have a dollar, why would I trade you my dollar?
They are equal! Kinda makes things pointless if they are equal.

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Not true.

If you have a canadian dollar, and I have an austrailian, and you want to buy a hotdog from an austrailian vendor, you'd want to trade me.

Equal does not mean boring. All equal means is you won't automatically win by having one skill over another.

It means people are free to mix up skills and play how they want,a nd they won't automatically be at a disadvantage. Just because a mage is equal to a warrior doesn't mean the game gets boring. It just means that whoever is the better player will win, not whoever happens to have the "ultimate skill set".

If everything is "balanced" correctly people who deserve the title best pvp will get it and so on. Bob is right, its not going to be an easy thing to except being a vet. Its going to of course have some rough spots because anything worth it is going to present minor problems. The quicker people start reporting bugs and staying with "the team". The sooner we will see change. There are going to be tons of people on this shard again. But everything needs to start off balanced. Then we will see who carry's the real UO skills.

AKA. It wont just be a few "vets", all being the same race, killing a few newbs that do not know which race to choose. I dont really know what all you gripers expect but the term "balanced" doesnt necessarily mean all the variables are going to be taken out and set in stone. There are so many variables to this game, it would be very difficult to tweak everything to be the same. And really doesnt it bother people when they already know who is going to win a fight? Or that you have no chance of killing da da da, so why even try? I personally am happy with these changes then everybody wont go and make a vampire. Two people with the same exact skill and stats fighting is pretty lame if you ask me. The the only depending factor is chance. Before you run off at the lip just do me ONE favor. Ask yourself if your only trying to give yourself an unfair advantage.

p.s. The veteran bonus is a privledge that used to be non-existent. If everyone is going to bitch and make threats then maybe staff should just remove it for yet even more "balance"? Is that not enough advantage for you? And who knows maybe after everything is "balanced" everyones new choice for a character will end up being a Bard.
Who Knows....

ScArY wrote: Or that you have no chance of killing da da da, so why even try? I personally am happy with these changes then everybody wont go and make a vampire. Two people with the same exact skill and stats fighting is pretty lame if you ask me. The the only depending factor is chance. Before you run off at the lip just do me ONE favor. Ask yourself if your only trying to give yourself an unfair advantage.

I don't need any 'advantage'

And especially not if I'm fighting you

I'll do you ONE (1) favour - and that is not to reply again to your posts which (clearly) have no idea what they're on about.

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you couldnt possibly be as dumb to threaten somebody who you dont even know?

umm i didnt say i was better at anybody but i would probably wipe your grandmas ass and serve with hot cakes..
but that is beside the point

is the topic of disadvantage a touchy one for you??
poor little guy.
Small penis complex*

GMBob wrote:Not true.

If you have a canadian dollar, and I have an austrailian, and you want to buy a hotdog from an austrailian vendor, you'd want to trade me.

With all due respect Bob: please!

Of course you know that 1AUD is worth $1.25NZ etc.


When I went to China, they wanted me to pay them in $US because it had more value than the Yuan. [once I told them I was an aussie they stopeed trying to rip me off - funny asides later...]

And I hear what you say about the weapons patch, but again, I respectfully disagree!
Nobody used a katana to fight.
There were still weapons that were 'weaker'
And there were weapons that were 'too slow' (macing)
It was LOOKING like the war fork was going to be the new 'weapon of choice'
Because in every system, no matter how balanced, a 'best way' rises to the surface.
The ONLY thing the weapons patch did was strengthen warriors to make them at least competitive in fights again.
[it did overpower vamps because they could have parry - but with a minor tweak this could have been fixed; all that was needed was to ask the people who would give a fair account]

You may have nuked races to an extent, but once people figure out the most effective method, you'll still end up with all characters looking the same.

I know you're trying to "reinvent" the shard from the ground up - AND DOING A GREAT JOB - but please don't completely disregard the thoughts of those of us who have been around for a good long time. A lot of the stuff we say IS stupid ("why can't things be like they always were" is normally a poor line of argument in any scenario!) - but it might just be that we're on to something in some areas.

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ScArY wrote: i would probably wipe your grandmas ass and serve with hot cakes..

You like old ladies


ewwwwwww

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Warlock Necro possible skills:

Necro 100
Anatomy 100 (useless as a necro I am sure)
Eval Intel 100
Healing 80
Mace 60
Magery 80
Magic Resist 80
Poisoning 100
Tactics 80
Wrestling 100

Ok those are the only useful things.
A total of 880 and if I drop wrestling cus unless a mage is pvm wrestling is garbage, it leaves 780 skills usefull.

Ok so Warlocks are made to be necro tanks and that is it. No other possible options.
Unless of course we want a necro fisher/alchy...that would be a deff surprise in a PvP bout.

I have no idea what to suggest except for allowing at least 85 magery.
This would allow for pvm. Perhaps set a total magery cap(necro/magery) to 175.

ONLY MENTIONS CRAFTING TYPE STUFF

1. I don't recall ever being warned about skill caps coming along anytime in the future.
2. I agree about the wood elf mining shacks....why are they there if we weren't supposed to use them?
3. I also agree with the wood elves having all the nature stuff and the frost elves having all the metal stuff.
4. How is it unbalanced to have a race that can GM all crafting skills if EVERYONE has access to that now? some of us just got a head start on it is all which sounds good since we started playing earlier would make sense for us to have more gm'd skills.
5. We do only have 5 char slots haveing to only take one up with a crafter works really well for EVERYONE who plays here.
6. saying we can transfer ONE Gm skill to a different char doesn't really help all that much since pretty much every skill has a partner skill.
7. Why not make a wood elf able to do everything except say fishing and make the frost elf into something like a fisher and water related?
8. maybe be more accommodating for those people who you are FORCING to lose possibly years of game time maybe rearrange there skills to their preference if your going to implement something like this.
9. I totally agree with who ever said does it matter who we have our crafting skills on? cause even as an ice elf i can only have 90 carpentry, thats like the biggest case of online blue balls you can have! (ty boog for the analogy) so so so close but not quite


The LAST thing this shard needs is to loose even more players Especially the dedicated ones who have been playing for as long as Belg has, maybe be a little more understanding of his anger, he was being very civil for just being told that he will have to completely rearrange at least one of his characters and possibly re train others. yes we should be mad and I think we are acting fairly pleasant about it so far.

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[email protected]

Ankhesenamun
Dedo Serenity
Fisherwmn
Ruby Estella
Enchantress

too many post for me to read and catch up tried to skim the interesting ones.

just wanna say that adding 100 points to humans is dumb idea, theyd own everything completely. not even possible to argue this. xkill tried but failed. race stone my ass, 800 point humans would destroy all easily.

tbh, i think humans are a bit overpowered now even with 700 because human mage was already the best magery pvp char by far, and now all other builds have gotten worse. not saying they should be less, just see how one of the already best pvp chars has lost nothing in these changes and the rest have so there ya go. also a human warrior is a shitload better than a vamp now looks like. only way staff are gonna make it so humans arent overpowered is too create a system where somehow having the extra points would really help in pvp and not just be "convenient"

as far as the changes, if nothing else, they are very interesting and gives me a reason to play more. i wouldnt care if my chars sufferred cause it would be fun to remold them to fit the changes or if i changed races.

only thing is until the rollbacks are complete, and the race changes are in stone, i cant see any reason to begin working seriously. just help test and wait for rollback to make final choices is all that can be done.

tbh i will be glad when staff make it one way and say ok no changes from here on out no matter what on race caps, (barring something we miss that just makes sense of course) that way good or bad i can at least be sure of my decisions from there on out.

that way i wont make a war mage and all of a sudden one day log on and cant wear plate armor anymore. was a good change probably, but tell that to the war mages...


things to think about while still testing:

the old wood elf ranger was exactly like a vamp rogue in every way except that a vamp rogue could gm bow and fencing whereas all a wood elf could do was bow. was pointless to have a ranger. we need to look for things like that to help staff finish with a balanced race system.

also i want to ask if there will be race/class specific things you can/cannot equip like before. and if there will even still be classes or will it only be races now.

thanks for all the work staff.

just initial thoughts, don't mean to step on anyones toes.

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LOV FOR LIFE

I've been staying out of commenting because people seem to calm down more when they talk to each other rather than have a staff point things out. Less defensiveness, I suppose.

Anyway I'm liking a lot of what i'm hearing, so lets keep the discussions goign for another day or two, and probably on friday or saturday i'll draw up some new alternatives and then this weekend when I talk with broadband we'll see which one fits his direction for the shard the best.

Dedo wrote:ONLY MENTIONS CRAFTING TYPE STUFF

1. I don't recall ever being warned about skill caps coming along anytime in the future.
2. I agree about the wood elf mining shacks....why are they there if we weren't supposed to use them?
3. I also agree with the wood elves having all the nature stuff and the frost elves having all the metal stuff.
4. How is it unbalanced to have a race that can GM all crafting skills if EVERYONE has access to that now? some of us just got a head start on it is all which sounds good since we started playing earlier would make sense for us to have more gm'd skills.
5. We do only have 5 char slots haveing to only take one up with a crafter works really well for EVERYONE who plays here.
6. saying we can transfer ONE Gm skill to a different char doesn't really help all that much since pretty much every skill has a partner skill.
7. Why not make a wood elf able to do everything except say fishing and make the frost elf into something like a fisher and water related?
8. maybe be more accommodating for those people who you are FORCING to lose possibly years of game time maybe rearrange there skills to their preference if your going to implement something like this.
9. I totally agree with who ever said does it matter who we have our crafting skills on? cause even as an ice elf i can only have 90 carpentry, thats like the biggest case of online blue balls you can have! (ty boog for the analogy) so so so close but not quite


The LAST thing this shard needs is to loose even more players Especially the dedicated ones who have been playing for as long as Belg has, maybe be a little more understanding of his anger, he was being very civil for just being told that he will have to completely rearrange at least one of his characters and possibly re train others. yes we should be mad and I think we are acting fairly pleasant about it so far.

I <3 you, for once someone gets it.

And stiffy or w/e the f*** your name is you havent played here long enough to even have an opinion. I know you say you have played here before but i started probably about the time you did before and have been here since i stuck through 8 month rollbacks and the shard being down for like 3-4 months. So when you have trained even 1 maxed out char(meaning 6-7 actual gmed skills on one char not just overcapping from noobness,) then you can talk until then just stfu because you don't have a clue.

Maybe There could be a stat cap depending on what race you have,seeing as how <<Vampires>> have the strenghth to be able to only fight with melee,then why not allow them to acceed a higher str then a human for example,And a warlock being able to hit higher int,And a human would be balanced with 140 str 140 dex,not being able to go higher then that,And work with the stats around it,

Vampire max str could be 176 and its dex would be limited to 130 or sumthing,

Human could only get 140 140 in either stats,

Elfs,Supposing there rly agile,can hit a maximum of dex,seeing as how they can only use range

Warlocks,maximum of int..

and so on and so on,Would make more sense withthe definitons of races trhat was given out

Vampires - Undead nobility, having existed for centuries as undying. Due to their inherent death, animals avoid them like the plague, and they gain almost no benefit human food. However the strength and speed that they posses from death gives them an excellent edge in combat. As such they see no reason to waste time on ranged weapons, being as they can much more easily use their advantage in melee. Their noble upbringing also precludes them from lowering themselves to thievery and begging.

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Heartless(cult)-PVPer
Sushi-Your friendly neibourghhood gm fisherman
Musa-Pvm mage in training

To me, this really sounds intruiging. I like the Idea of having more difference between the races then just skill cap and racial stone. A little tweaking on the stat caps might be worthwhile...

Being as we can barely find enough to balance out the skillcap and race stone difference, i severly doubt we will be able to find a way to balance out a stat cap difference as well.

Not saying it's impossible, just that realistically it will be hard to come up with an idea that is balanced, since 1 point of str in cap != 1 point of dex in cap != 1 point of int in cap.